Ansky

Have reservations for our anniversary at 630, will probably be home around 8-9 server time.

To be fair, it's already happening regardless of having the rank with the same people who would be in that rank. But yes, I would also be good without all the extra hoopla of ranks.

Having a Core Raider as just a step up from Raider and based on seniority would be more appropriate. Like Raider, it would have basic requirements, for example six months in the guild and 80% attendance, and it would give that fine line between who is core and who is not. Yes, there will be many, but it would also give new people something to goal towards. And it wouldn't cause drama because there is no competition.

Guilds will always have some kind of drama. The officers have done a good job at keeping the guild together through it. I just don't see core raider stuff being anything but extra drama without actually benefiting the raid.

So have 9 Core Raiders chosen by Raiders to receive rank, some extra repair gold, and the power to remove each other from the rank. I guess I don't understand the point. It sounds unnesessary. I can only see this causing drama between Raiders and Core Raiders, and if Core Raiders choose to kick someone for one reason or another, that someone will undoubtedly gquit. We don't even kick people from the raid because that's not how we do things. This will be the epitome of shit sturring imo. No guild needs to initiate drama, and this can only end up with hurt feelings and gquits. Not to mention, we're all human so we're all automatically disqualified haha. If it aint broke, don't fix it. Our guild was doing just fine 3 weeks ago. =\

I do want to add that I like the idea of having a rank for exceptional players who know their class and top the meters as well as good attendance and willingness to help others. Those who recruits and raiders can come to for help. No more than one person of each class/spec but also not people of a class just because they're only ones in the guild. They would have to be exceptional and want the position. With the extra responsibilities of being available for help, they will get the extra benefits that core raider rank got and the bragging rights which gives those who care incentive to get better. Maybe call it something like Master Raider with class/spec in the comment. Just an idea.

From what Varlash has been saying, I keep getting that Core Raider = exceptional player. One who knows the class, tops the meters, and is always on time and prepared. That is the mindset of a hardcore guild. The -core- of this guild are the raiders who show up every week and stay through the wipes and improve every wipe until we kill the boss. That is OUR core. We all know who they are, we see them every raid night. That's why the Core Raider rank to good players versus good raiders will not work for this guild. People will feel hurt because they put in the time but because they're not great they don't get the recognition. I can't think of one person who fits ALL the criteria you listed. And, If we recruit great players that fit the criteria they will leave once they realize just how casual the rest of us are, and that's what has happened already with those who joined in the past few months.

We are? We barely got 2 heroics in MSV and TOT. The only reason we're where we are now is because we have the time and the people willing to raid. This is the perspective of raiders that needs to be addressed. I don't mind being a "hardmode raiding guild" for what it is, but you said it yourself, we are not on the same page. There are plenty of people who are casual players who don't usually log in besides raiding. I'm one of them. They rely on the guild bank to provide flasks. Not having flasks does hinder the group's performance. A member who doesn't raid doesn't have any reason to drop herbs in the GB. A raider who specifically does it to help out the group does. It's like Ninja said last night, she had a spot in the raid before because she went out of her way to get the mats and fish feasts when others wouldn't. That takes time and dedication, and it does make you a core raider.

I think if you really want to have a Raider vs Core Raider, Core Raider should be people who have proven to be part of the team through the amount of time they have been in the guild and the amount of raiding they have done with us while Raider should be mostly new people and casuals. I understand it was meant as incentive to step up your game with all the requirements but that just won't work imo. You can't compare not dying to mechanics to showing up for raid to dropping 10k worth of herbs in the guild bank. We all work together to make shit happen. The core is the core and we all know who we see in the raid every week.

There is one major problem I see with core raider atm. This guild is and has been since I've joined it, a casual guild. Yes, we do good progression, but we also bring people in who have been in the guild for a long time and have been raiders for a long time who do end up dying almost every fight to mechanics and we don't really care because it's atmosphere first. It's what makes this guild such a great environment. Remember when we were telling people who apped before the merger that we probably won't get past 2-4 heroic bosses before going on break and letting our 10man take over? Now since the server merger and we've gotten many raiders and we've tasted our share of heroics (holy shit 8/14???) we're slowly losing that casual atmosphere and great environment. Is that nessessarily a bad thing? Depends on who you ask. What do we want from the guild in the next 6 months before the xpack? That's something we should be asking. TLDR: The core raider system forgoes our long-time standing raiders and that's a big issue in a casual guild. And then, when someone does get core raider who for example dies to mechanics all the time but is always there and ready, people get angry that that person didn't deserve it. There is no winning when there are "requirements". Do I know how to fix it? No. But the current system only hurts the feelings of people who make this guild what it is. So that's my 2c.

Aw but they're so cute!

Last attempt of the night ftw.

Never mind, it's tomorrow. Maybe I should go back since I apparently can't read a calendar.

Have a kindergarden orientation thingy 630-730 so probably won't be on until 8.

Taking the kids to see Despicable Me 2 at 6 so might be a little late getting on.

Not so little anymore huh

My son's preschool graduation is at 7 but it's just a few minutes away so I might be on at 8 or a little later.

I agree for both of these. I've had people tell me they had issues registering with it not accepting their email (I did too until I just used FB). Not sure if it's a bug or what. I do think we need more kill shots.

Just wanted to say, some potential recruits on the forums are turning away after seeing this thread. Maybe make it so only members can see it? Or do we not want to recruit until we figure this out?

I've been checking this thread and thinking about this all day, and I think I'm more angry at Blizz for making transfers such a pain and killing off our server with killing 25man raiding. If I'm one of two, transferring isn't completely out of the question, but we really do need to make sure we go to a server that needs a casual 2 day 25 man. Instead of leveling new chars I'd say go to a prospective server and ask in trade and on the forums about if anyone is interested in joining. If there is interest, we can go from there. Log on during peak times to make sure there's no que times. My preference is Normal over PVP.

I -honestly- did not think we had an issue with recruiting because any time Bash said anything over mumble it was, "if you have any friends, ask them to join". To me, that said "ask your friends to fill in our currently missing spots until our main raiders come back" not "we must recruit more people regardless of familiar status or we're going to transfer off the server". If I knew we needed actual recruiting help, I would have stepped in a long time ago, but we've had enough every raid night by 8 so I didn't realize it was that much of an issue. That said, last night people seemed pretty excited about a transfer. =\ I can't help feeling like it's going to divide the guild.

Here are my reasons: 1) I have many alts with different professions that accomodate my main with what I need. I don't want to leave them behind nor do I want to spend $100 on transferring them. 2) I have two RL friends on this sever that literally just transferred yesterday to play together. 3) I honestly don't see a big issue with the server. We always end up with enough for a 25m, people who miss some days show up other days. We went from having to swap people every fight to having just enough each night. We turned down a lot of people last patch, and lost a lot this patch. I would say try agressive recruiting tactics, forums, trade chat, etc. (I am more than willing to help!) before transferring to another server that, despite having a high pop, might not have people who can do/want our raid times. It just seems like a huge risk to take on a problem that is experienced by WoW in general (25m dying because 10m gives the same rewards), not really our server (esp with server transfers being so easy now that off-server recruiting is very common). Who is to say we leave all our friends, alts, and memories behind just to end up in the same situation (or worse because not everyone will transfer so instead of having exactly 25 people at 8 we'll have 20 and no recruits)? Not to mention que times and lag outs for high pop servers are no fun. I think that's all. I do see a lot of yes votes and I don't want to be the rock in the shoe, but these are my honest thoughts. This guild has been awesome and I wouldn't want it to go.

Might be late. 7 year wedding anniversary so we're going out to a nice place for dinner.